Exanima - SG crossover!

bobchaos

Member
It occurs to me there's plenty of nice assets to be found in Exanima, it would be a shame not to use them in SG too! I think it would be cool to have the first 3 levels of Exanima available in SG somewhere, even if it's just for show.

Maybe some new nefarious business is happening down there 20 years later?
 

bobchaos

Member
I understand all that, just thought it would be a nice wink to those who played Exanima, a little something those who get on board only with the full release of SG won't be able to fully appreciate.
 

HopeDIV

Moderator
Considering how the lore might be tied together, I would expect a little something in Sui Generis about Exanima(Or just the events).

From the kickstarter for SG:
"Thaumaturges, people with powerful psychic abilities, have abandoned their once benevolent nature turning to cruel and dark activities in their quest for ultimate power. Awoken by impending threats, an abandoned and damaged being gives rise to its ancient weapons who now walk amongst the people again"

I don't think its too far fetched that we and/or Thaven are going to be waking up a damaged being, (the Guardian, who was damaged by the yet unnamed 'Hero'. ) and set forth the events that happen in Sui Generis.
So I kinda expect that that the current dungeon/levels will play some role in the world of Sui Generis.

TLDR: We might be the little shits that start it all, so problably will have a reference in SG.
 

bobchaos

Member
Exanima and SG take place in the same universe, I believe Exanima is 20 years earlier though.
It is according to the main website. I suspect in SG I'll be able to locate a now much more powerful Thaven and have a nice conversation at swordpoint with him :p I'm certain the events of Exanima will be mentioned, I suspect they are key to the events of SG.

What I'm less certain of was my ability to re-enter parts of the Exanima dungeon in SG, hence this thread, but Konggary says it's likely to happen. It would only make sense really, the Underworld should be a big theme in SG too.
 
Well, I am willing to bet that we will encounter Thaven in Exanima shortly after he woke the Guardian. He may be a super-being, feeding off the power of his awakened diety, or nearly dead with the whole "what have I done?" thing. What would be funny is, if we stopped Thaven from summoning the Guardian in Exanima, we get and launch SG, it reads the Exanima savegame file, noticing that we stopped Thaven, and then loads Sui Generis with a world that nothing is wrong, the "impending doom" was stopped by you 20 years earlier (lol).

Jenn BRD
 

Roryn

Member
Well, I am willing to bet that we will encounter Thaven in Exanima shortly after he woke the Guardian. He may be a super-being, feeding off the power of his awakened diety, or nearly dead with the whole "what have I done?" thing. What would be funny is, if we stopped Thaven from summoning the Guardian in Exanima, we get and launch SG, it reads the Exanima savegame file, noticing that we stopped Thaven, and then loads Sui Generis with a world that nothing is wrong, the "impending doom" was stopped by you 20 years earlier (lol).

Jenn BRD
I dunno, I find it hard to believe that Thaven could survive for that long.

But then again, he's made it that far and apparently has some.. helmet or something.
 

bobchaos

Member
I dunno, I find it hard to believe that Thaven could survive for that long.

But then again, he's made it that far and apparently has some.. helmet or something.
You're confusing Thaven and the necromancer, as far as we know Thaven himself never entered the portal facility nor the Underworld, instead using his minions (the necromancer, Papin and Hamon) to go and research the goodies found there. There's a solid chance the necromancer is already dead, or will be by the time Exanima is done, but I suspect we won't actually meet with Thaven in Exanima.
 

Roryn

Member
You're confusing Thaven and the necromancer, as far as we know Thaven himself never entered the portal facility nor the Underworld, instead using his minions (the necromancer, Papin and Hamon) to go and research the goodies found there. There's a solid chance the necromancer is already dead, or will be by the time Exanima is done, but I suspect we won't actually meet with Thaven in Exanima.
It's been a while since I played the story mode or read the journals, but don't Papin's journals make strong suggestions that Thaven is there with them? Also, I thought Hamon was that "thug still sending people down [there]" (but I could just be misrememebering names). Tell me if that's not the case, because I was never sure about how many people were down there exactly.
 

bobchaos

Member
It's been a while since I played the story mode or read the journals, but don't Papin's journals make strong suggestions that Thaven is there with them? Also, I thought Hamon was that "thug still sending people down [there]" (but I could just be misrememebering names). Tell me if that's not the case, because I was never sure about how many people were down there exactly.
I could be wrong about all I'm about to say, but this is what I got from the story regarding those characters:

I'm assuming the only living people down in the dungeon are the player and perhaps the necromancer. Papin, the necromancer's apprentice, has been zombified, so is not technically "alive" o_O It's speculation, but I'm fair sure Papin is the only zombie on lvl 4 on account that the necromancer kept him close, so probably took him with him through the portal, and there are no other zombies anywhere in sight, only the skellies that belonged to the underworld "civilization" guards. Chances are he abandoned Papin while trying to escape Sir.

Hamon has probably never entered the dungeon, but yeah, he's the one sending more test subject to the necromancer, so he at least knows about it and it's exact location. Solid chance he's the author of the letter the player finds on himself when you start as "unknown", implying the player is just another poor sod sent to the dungeon on a bogus quest. That or he's the necromancer!

Thaven appears to be a leader within the Guardian worship cult, or it's heavily suggested anyhow. He seems to know an awful lot about the dungeon and the Underworld, so he may have been down there at one time, but the necromancer's need to "send word to Thaven" from the Underworld confirms (or at least heavily imply) that if he's ever been down there, he's not at the time of the events of Exanima.

Anyhow, speculation aside, I can say for sure that the necromancer has been to the Underworld, altho it's possible he died down there, Papin was dead and zombified before crossing the portal (if he crossed at all), Hamon is a "facilitator" working with the necromancer and Thaven, and Thaven is a figure of authority to those 3 characters in some way but is not himself in the Underworld (or the portal facility), preferring to send his minions.
 
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bobchaos

Member
Well, I am willing to bet that we will encounter Thaven in Exanima shortly after he woke the Guardian. He may be a super-being, feeding off the power of his awakened diety, or nearly dead with the whole "what have I done?" thing. What would be funny is, if we stopped Thaven from summoning the Guardian in Exanima, we get and launch SG, it reads the Exanima savegame file, noticing that we stopped Thaven, and then loads Sui Generis with a world that nothing is wrong, the "impending doom" was stopped by you 20 years earlier (lol).

Jenn BRD
I'm thinking more something like this: The player character in Exanima gets to the bottom, finds whatever hidden power is down there and decides to keep it for himself. Then you load that save in SG, and the main bad guy is your PC from Exanima, returned from the Underworld with untold power and some serious mental issues due to exposure to the Guardian's influence :D Incidentally, he'd be fighting with all your end game gear and skills from Exanima, on top of his new superpowers >: D

Considering how the lore might be tied together, I would expect a little something in Sui Generis about Exanima(Or just the events).

From the kickstarter for SG:
"Thaumaturges, people with powerful psychic abilities, have abandoned their once benevolent nature turning to cruel and dark activities in their quest for ultimate power. Awoken by impending threats, an abandoned and damaged being gives rise to its ancient weapons who now walk amongst the people again"

I don't think its too far fetched that we and/or Thaven are going to be waking up a damaged being, (the Guardian, who was damaged by the yet unnamed 'Hero'. ) and set forth the events that happen in Sui Generis.
So I kinda expect that that the current dungeon/levels will play some role in the world of Sui Generis.

TLDR: We might be the little shits that start it all, so problably will have a reference in SG.

Regarding the "abandoned and damaged being", I suspect it's a reference to the source of the SG PC's ability to reincarnate (It sends "ancient weapons to walk among the people", sounds like a great description for 100% immortal beings!). The Guardian of the Underworld is likely what's driving the Thaumaturges mad as suggested by a lot of scrolls in Exanima. Thaven and the necromancer are likely the first victims of its spreading influence. If it's power is extending into the Overworld too, it's likely not so much "damaged" as "growing way too powerful to contain"! He's more likely the "impending threat" that woke up the PC's deity.
 
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Roryn

Member
I could be wrong about all I'm about to say, but this is what I got from the story regarding those characters:

I'm assuming the only living people down in the dungeon are the player and perhaps the necromancer. Papin, the necromancer's apprentice, has been zombified, so is not technically "alive" o_O It's speculation, but I'm fair sure Papin is the only zombie on lvl 4 on account that the necromancer kept him close, so probably took him with him through the portal, and there are no other zombies anywhere in sight, only the skellies that belonged to the underworld "civilization" guards. Chances are he abandoned Papin while trying to escape Sir.

Hamon has probably never entered the dungeon, but yeah, he's the one sending more test subject to the necromancer, so he at least knows about it and it's exact location. Solid chance he's the author of the letter the player finds on himself when you start as "unknown", implying the player is just another poor sod sent to the dungeon on a bogus quest. That or he's the necromancer!

Thaven appears to be a leader within the Guardian worship cult, or it's heavily suggested anyhow. He seems to know an awful lot about the dungeon and the Underworld, so he may have been down there at one time, but the necromancer's need to "send word to Thaven" from the Underworld confirms (or at least heavily imply) that if he's ever been down there, he's not at the time of the events of Exanima.

Anyhow, speculation aside, I can say for sure that the necromancer has been to the Underworld, altho it's possible he died down there, Papin was dead and zombified before crossing the portal (if he crossed at all), Hamon is a "facilitator" working with the necromancer and Thaven, and Thaven is a figure of authority to those 3 characters in some way but is not himself in the Underworld (or the portal facility), preferring to send his minions.
Alright, we clearly agree about Papin and Hamon, but I think I remember seeing Papin's writings (unless they weren't his... hard to tell sometimes) about his relationship with Thaven as though Thaven was actually there with him, but obv. it's possible I misinterpreted. As for this Necromancer character, what makes you so sure that the necromancer isn't actually Thaven himself?

Ok, I think I'm getting this now... The writings that name Thaven directly aren't Papin's writings, but the necromancer's, am I right? However, if that's the case, then did Papin actually write anything about the other characters?

I ended up thinking that it was maybe just Papin and Thaven down there because no one else was mentioned, whether through pronouns or name, if I remember correctly...

I found that interesting, because under that interpretation Thaven views Papin as his apprentice, while Papin mentioned seeing him as more of a "friend" than a superior.
 
If they were writing to each other, its doubtful they were in the same complex. Why would they write letters if they could just walk to visit the other person?
 

Roryn

Member
If they were writing to each other, its doubtful they were in the same complex. Why would they write letters if they could just walk to visit the other person?
Oh no, I don't mean that they were writing to each other, they seemed more like personal journal entries I think.
 

bobchaos

Member
Alright, we clearly agree about Papin and Hamon, but I think I remember seeing Papin's writings (unless they weren't his... hard to tell sometimes) about his relationship with Thaven as though Thaven was actually there with him, but obv. it's possible I misinterpreted. As for this Necromancer character, what makes you so sure that the necromancer isn't actually Thaven himself?

Ok, I think I'm getting this now... The writings that name Thaven directly aren't Papin's writings, but the necromancer's, am I right? However, if that's the case, then did Papin actually write anything about the other characters?

I ended up thinking that it was maybe just Papin and Thaven down there because no one else was mentioned, whether through pronouns or name, if I remember correctly...

I found that interesting, because under that interpretation Thaven views Papin as his apprentice, while Papin mentioned seeing him as more of a "friend" than a superior.
It's a bit hard to say for sure since no one signs their notes, but I do not believe any of the notes we find to belong to Papin. Evidence of his death is found on level 1, leaving him very little time to write anything. I suspect he was one of the first experiment subjects.

That said, think about this: Thaven was very knowledgeable about all things Underworld related, but still wanted to find out more. If he had been down there himself, you'd think we'd find more evidence of his own research, but there's no signs of a journal written by him. Only the necromancer was performing research, and he still needed to send reports to Thaven, so it's unlikely he's down there.

I think the necromancer (who is never named) is the author of pretty much all the more recent parchments (few obvious exceptions like the letter you find near the dead body in the first area). Mind you, this is one of the reasons I thought the story was great: there's doubt. It could be that I'm attributing some of these letters to the wrong people and there's no way to know for sure. That said, I'm pretty confident in my interpretation of the story. Guess we'll know for sure when all the content is released, in the meantime we can let our imaginations fill in the gaps :D
 

Roryn

Member
It's a bit hard to say for sure since no one signs their notes, but I do not believe any of the notes we find to belong to Papin. Evidence of his death is found on level 1, leaving him very little time to write anything. I suspect he was one of the first experiment subjects.

That said, think about this: Thaven was very knowledgeable about all things Underworld related, but still wanted to find out more. If he had been down there himself, you'd think we'd find more evidence of his own research, but there's no signs of a journal written by him. Only the necromancer was performing research, and he still needed to send reports to Thaven, so it's unlikely he's down there.

I think the necromancer (who is never named) is the author of pretty much all the more recent parchments (few obvious exceptions like the letter you find near the dead body in the first area). Mind you, this is one of the reasons I thought the story was great: there's doubt. It could be that I'm attributing some of these letters to the wrong people and there's no way to know for sure. That said, I'm pretty confident in my interpretation of the story. Guess we'll know for sure when all the content is released, in the meantime we can let our imaginations fill in the gaps :D
Very interesting, and it certainly seems valid as an interpretation. And yes, of course, there's doubt, and I agree that makes it great!
 
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